.png)
Peer Effect
Best way to scale? Your peers have the answers.
This is the podcast for scaleup founders looking for insightful, actionable wisdom from some of the best operators around. Each week we’ll explore one secret that other founders and experts are using right now and how to implement it.
It’s practical wisdom to build the company AND life you want. Hosted by renowned founder coach and advisor James Johnson.
You’ve survived to £1m, now let’s scale to £10m+.
Peer Effect
How To Actually Be A Disciplined Founder
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
This week's question, from a listener also called Freddie: "How do I become more disciplined?" James and Freddie take apart the version of discipline most founders are quietly measuring themselves against, and why it's usually somebody else's routine.
They get into the real distinction, why motivation and commitment aren't the same thing, and the one habit that's a genuine signal of discipline no matter how you're wired.
More from James:
Connect with James on LinkedIn or at peer-effect.com
If you're committed indefinitely or for a really extended period of time to tasks and activities that you just don't find energizing, or you're not good at, or they're not creating impact, so you're not aligned with your skills, you're not aligned with energizers, and you're not aligned with impact, then you will likely burn out quite quickly. And so with what you commit to, having like the discernment and awareness to think um you can do it for a short period of time, but long term you really need to, you really need to be aligned. So once you're aware of your priorities, you make sure time reflects it. And then you say, okay, is the theory working in practice? Am I getting the results that I think um I thought would work? And then it's the that in that implementation time you um you experiment and you and you just you play. And then you take a step back again. You're like, okay, what's working, what's not working.
SPEAKER_05Often then you try and put someone in their team, and number two is often a very sort of long-suffering, organized person who's trying to like run around. But it's how to harness that in a really powerful way where that super strength doesn't become depreciating just because at some point everyone comes burnt out because like, oh, well, it's they're so chaotic. Yeah, it's impossible to add structure. Welcome to the Peer Effect post bag. I'm James Johnson, joined by Freddie Burley. We asked for your questions, and Freddie and I are gonna tackle them together. These aren't theoretical case studies, it's the stuff keeping you up at 2 a.m. Let's get answering. Welcome to the Peer Effect post bag. I'm James Johnson.
SPEAKER_00I'm Freddie Burley.
SPEAKER_05So, Freddie, we've had a question from another Freddie. How how do I become more disciplined?
SPEAKER_00This comes up a lot in my coaching. And typically from the humans who would describe themselves as ADHD, more creatively skewed. And they often have this idea in their mind that to be a good founder, you have to be disciplined. And there's often this story underneath it where if I'm not disciplined, I'm a bad founder and someone's gonna figure it out, or my team are gonna find out that I'm really chaotic. My team are gonna find out that I'm that I'm um not on top of everything at all times, and I need to be on top of everything at all times. And so that's often a kind of story that accompanies the how do I become more disciplined as a human. And a few things that I've found work very well is discipline. They often often people have this idea in their head of what it looks like to be disciplined. And they're like disciplined people wake up at 5 a.m. every day and they do the same kind of exercise and they eat like specific meals, and then they go and do this other thing, and then they have their day time-boxed, and like they've got this idea in their head of what it means to be disciplined. And especially for more of the kind of creative, intuitive, like energy-driven types of leaders, you don't need to be disciplined in like you do the same thing every day in the same way with the same, same, same, same, same, same, same. The most important thing is that you know what your top three priorities are at any one time. And I think you can find your own way of applying discipline. And discipline is almost like, what are you consistently committed to? And so it comes back to like what do you want to be consistently committed to and what are the most important things. I think often when when people get um lost is when they're committed to too many things that actually aren't priorities. And so then they become chaotic and then they drop lots of balls and actually you need to have your energy focused on. I think there's a part here which is about alignment and especially for ADHD, knowing often your brain just doesn't let you do things that that you don't want to do. And so you kind of need to work with that and you need to be very well aligned and focus on things that are most important and that you enjoy doing. And so you need to become very discerning around what those things are because you can, willpower does work, but it runs out. I would say the most important things are like know what your top three priorities are at any one time and try and design your time around that, but it doesn't have to look the same every day and work on alignment or towards alignment. So even if you can't focus on the things that you're best at and create the most impact now, have a plan to hiring, delegating so that you can get in that lane because that's when you'll really thrive.
SPEAKER_05Sort of a related how how can I be motivated all the time? It's kind of like a similarish question. It's like, but it's sort of based on a fallacy. Yeah. Like the chimp paradox stuff with pressure Steve Peters talked about doing something like motivation and commitment. And motivation is quite a chimp thing in terms of am I feeling up for doing this? And actually, commitment is having a clear plan and sticking to it. Yeah. And actually, it's commitment that you want, and commitment's like the human side, and it doesn't rely on being motivated every day. It's just like it's raining, I'm gonna get up and go and do it anyway. Like it doesn't feel great today, I'm gonna do it anyway. And I think that's because you are clear what it is, like what is important to you and what you want, and therefore what you most need to do to get that done. And I think when people start drifting away, exactly what's got again, you get an innate sense of when you're doing stuff that's not taking you to where you want to be, and you're kind of becoming that sort of busy fool, or it's kind of and that's not you can sort of hide in the endorphins of like ticking off the task list.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_05But actually, deep down, you know, you're not moving the needle on the things you need to move the needle on.
SPEAKER_00Totally. And it can sometimes be like you're range, you're kind of rearranging your chairs on the Titanic. It's it's just like you're focusing your time and energy on things that just don't matter. And I think also there's a part there of like why you're avoiding the things that do matter.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_00There can be a self-awareness piece where you're like, I actually don't know what the most impactful area for me to focus on is right now, or um, I don't I don't know what I'm really good at. Or like there can be a self-awareness building, but most founders have done like intentionally or unintentionally enough work to know where they're most effective and where they're most impactful and how they spend their time there. But then it can often be like, I don't want to disappoint people, I don't want to overburden my team, I don't want them to burn out. I don't like these stories can start to come up, which stop people from putting like genuine boundaries and also empowering the people around them to do their jobs and to step up and to grow in the ambiguity and to grow in the space. Yeah. And along with that kind of um, I love that framework of don't just do what you feel like doing, do what you've committed to. That they both rely, though, on this the commitment piece can if you're committed to the wrong tasks. And what I mean by that is if you're committed indefinitely or for a really extended period of time to tasks and activities that you just don't find energizing, or you're not good at, or they're not creating impact. So you're not aligned with your skills, you're not aligned with energizers, and you're not aligned with impact, then you will likely burn out quite quickly. And so with what you commit to, having like the discernment and awareness to think um you can do it for a short period of time, but long term, you really need to, you really need to be aligned. Um, because especially when things go wrong and you're doing things that you're not good at, you're not energized by, it's not, it's not moving the needle a huge amount. You you burn out much faster and um and it things start to look a bit dark.
SPEAKER_05There's a narrative though, isn't there, around this sort of the founder who wears the same clothes every day. The sort of you you you read like to I usually when I was a kid, I used to read sort of the Sunday Times How I Made It section. And every time we're like, what are your habits? How does your day start? It's like, well, I get up at six to five thirty, maybe to to exercise. Then by six thirty, I've done all my emails. Then by seven, I'm always like, that is that is so not how your day actually starts. But you read it enough times in the subs you take in the sense, oh well, if I'm not getting up at five o'clock and I'm not sort of having a cryo bath or something, then I'm like, Yeah. We take in all this sort of narrative around what success is meant to be tied to without realizing it's someone else's narrative they're trying to portray.
SPEAKER_01Totally.
SPEAKER_05And even if that does work for them, I think you sort of like sometimes what looks like success looks like you might be different. You might have a different rhythm, like your clock might look differently, the type of work, how you like to do it is yeah, different.
SPEAKER_00That's a really great point. Because I think especially when you also don't you don't A know if those stories are true that people are telling about their morning routines. And exactly like it might those routines might work well for them and they can sound impressive. Um, but then another person tries them on and actually inhibits their performance and it inhibits their development, inhibits their ability to connect. Like, so you just trial and error until you figure out like what's the routine and structure that gives me the best energy to focus on the most important things and how do I do that consistently?
SPEAKER_05But I think it's being very deliberate about this. 100% I think the gap that I often see is people might have that vision, but have they and hopefully they've broken it down to like what does that mean for their key key priorities they need to focus on? But then how are they making sure that they use they decide whether or not they're going to do stuff based on that? Like, are those priorities visible to them every day? So they're going, is that stuff showing up in my to do in my to-do list? Like, have I set my week up to give myself space to actually get stuff done rather than being responsive? I think there's a there's a very practical bit that people often don't come to in terms of do I have the right, like am I building stuff into my day at the right time so that it's motivated for me for example, I like running, I like running, I like doing basic aerobic stuff morning. I like I hate doing weight stuff, I like like doing that at lunchtime. If I try and do that the other way around, it just doesn't work for me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_05There's no particular does that matter? It just means I just need to sort of acknowledge that. Do I even need to change it, acknowledge it and build around it? Yes. So I think sort of knowing yourself and going, okay, I don't have to change everything. Some things just some things just are. Like I think I think that's the hard thing around coaching. It's like knowing when when just to accept something and when to coach and try and change it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, completely. Completely. And that that all just requires slowing down, like assessing, am I aware of what my priorities are? Is my diary reflective of my priorities or is it reflective of all these other things that I'm spending my time on, like busy work that doesn't actually move the needle, it doesn't bring me forwards. And then it's the experimentation. So once you're aware of your priorities, you make sure time reflects it. And then you say, okay, is the theory working in practice? Am I getting the results that I think um I thought would work? And then it's the that in that implementation time you um you experiment and you and you just you play. And then you take a step back again. You're like, okay, what's working, what's not working?
SPEAKER_05I think that's your point. Like you you you set your experiment and go, okay, let's try it. Yeah. And then come back to it. Like you're not going to get it right first time. And actually, you might get it right, but at some stage there might be a life change, or it means actually it needs to shift. So I would say it's worth coming back to at least every quarter, maybe more frequently when you're when you're first starting on it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, totally, totally.
SPEAKER_05But on the discipline thing, I do wonder whether there are certain disciplines that founders just need regardless. So, for example, I wonder whether respecting other people's time is a discipline slash habit, which is super important in terms of like what like show what time you show up stuff once you come into doing it. Are you moving things around for your teams? Or are you sort of regularly changing meeting times because you're like there's a level of discipline which we're setting which is unhelpful in terms of this kind of like must be up at five, must have run a marathon buy breakfast, must have like it's kind of like that is these are things that but I wonder whether there are certain disciplines that if you're not delivering as a founder, become like a almost too much chaos. Like I think allowing yourself, if you are more creative, more space for chaos. But I I don't know what your thoughts around are there some disciplines that you do need to work on and hold to.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it almost starts it that's almost like what are the behaviors that as opposed to I I often kind of taking it's my mind's almost gone a bit matter, but like taking a step back, if you're consistently moving things that you had committed to, that would be a signal that something's not working. It's it's either that you're you're committing to things that aren't important, and so then looking at what are my commitments, or you're allowing yourself to get pulled into things that aren't important, and therefore you're ignoring the things that are important. And so that like kind of ebb and flow between um if you are, if you do operate more intuitively, more creatively, you typically want to have less things that you're committed to that are structured, and therefore you allow more space and time to follow the things that you're like energetically driven by. And that's when I think like less is more. So like less commitments, less priorities, but awareness of what those priorities are, so that you are genuinely spending your time and energy focused on them. When it comes to meetings, I think as a general rule, it it does it, that's a depreciating behavior. So if you consistently move people, um, if you consistently turn up late, if you consistently like the the signals that you're giving, you should expect your team to mirror them back at you. So you expect them to move their commitments to not follow through with what they say they're gonna do, et cetera, et cetera. And so I would describe that as depreciating as opposed to appreciating. And so in those moments, it's like, okay, coming, taking a step back, like, am I when I say yes to something, do is it important? Um, or do I like feel like I have to say yes and therefore I end up doing it? Um, and if I say things that yes, if I do commit to important things, but I'm not there because I'm getting distracted by less important things, then that's also a signal that something needs to shift. So I think, and we don't get it right all the time, right? We all there are we all need to move meetings and we turn up late to things and like but if it's your consistent pattern that you are always late, you are always saying yes to things that aren't important or getting distracted by lower priorities, that's when you need to start it's not it like start um looking at how you've set up your time.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So it's like that was I don't know it's deliberate. You're still you're still setting up a structure, just the structure you're setting up might get allow you a lot more flexibility than someone who is more traditionally uh structured, uh disciplined or like I I think the thing I somehow struggle with is you do sort of get founders who are kind of those creative geniuses, yeah. Who their genius is in their kind of ability to react and think of things, come up with ideas, and it's not just a typical founder, oh I've had an idea, let's change my mind. It's like it just like really that's their super strength. Often then you try and put someone in their team, and number two is often a very sort of long-suffering, organized person who's trying to like run around. But it's how to harness that in a really powerful way where that super strength doesn't become depreciating just because at some point everyone comes burnt out because like oh well, it's they're so chaotic, yeah, it's impossible to add structure.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05So I I think that's always a that's often a tension that I see is how you harness that. Because this whole thing about the vision really integrator and all this stuff, but really what's coming down to like if you give one person total freedom, it's very hard to structure around that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, totally. And it can, there's like a real dark side of that on the impact on the team and people. I've worked with quite a few founders who would identify as that. And I think the more time and energy they can spend, focus on the things that they are most impactful in. So that they're really siloed and you create like boundaries around where they what they're present in, what they're not present in. And also as a team, you become hyper-aware of like often those humans, there's like big pros, brig cons. And the kind of creative genius um, or uh they they need time to be being creative, they need time to be being creating, and so they often need space and they need like a four-hour time block where they just go really deep in something, and maybe their superpowers aren't in like team meetings and in management and in so I think it's often about like channeling it and then figuring out a rhythm between you so that that human's also open enough to be like, where do I create the most value and where do I actually take value away from the team? And it can often be because they can often be quite impulsive in their characters too. And so they can like come up with like ideas that they want to implement and it completely distracts the team, or so it's channeling that, but that's where the self-awareness piece comes in to be like, am I aware of my strengths? Am I aware of where they're most applicable, where they're most, where they create the most value? And also, can my team honestly give me feedback to be like, this is like the negative impact that you're having at the moment too? So you're listening to to people around you. Um, so then you're f and then you can find resonance of how do I apply these gifts in the most successful way, and how do I become very aware of my shadows or negative traits or like the negative manifestations of my of my traits too?
SPEAKER_05So I think my motive from this is one is just be aware of what's your subconscious narrative, subconscious, conscious narrative of and where it's come from. Yeah. But ultimately be very deliberate around how you are achieving your goals. Like, are you clear on them? And what are your how are you setting it up to so to most to give you m the biggest chance of achieving?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Amazing.
SPEAKER_05If you want to reach out and discuss any of these, you can catch us on LinkedIn. Um thanks for listening and happy scaling.
